Why Cincinnati Reds say they compare to big-name, big-game Philadelphia Phillies rotation

The big-name, bigger-bucks Philadelphia Phillies swaggered into Great American Ball Park this week making headlines for the biggest reason they’re one of the favorites to win another National League title.

And $330 million Bryce Harper wasn’t even around to hit home runs three at a time like he did a few weeks ago against these same Cincinnati Reds.

But the Phillies $378 million starting rotation was.

And flexing.

And giving the Reds something to dream on as they try to assemble their own playoff season this year.

“I don’t think we’re that far behind that rotation,” said Reds right-hander Nick Martinez, who opened the season in the Cincinnati starting five and rejoins the group Thursday to face the Phillies and $126 million ace Zack Wheeler.

“Those guys have the experience and the stuff. Our guys have the stuff. Now they just need to get the repetitions that those guys have.”

Until the Reds clobbered Christopher Sanchez and the Phillies bullpen to snap the Phillies’ seven-game winning streak Tuesday night, the Philadelphia rotation was 6-0 with a 0.70 ERA during the streak – with a league-leading 2.14 rotation ERA through 23 games.

Just the way they drew up their winning formula for this season.

The way the Reds drew it up, that is.

“It’s something for us to shoot for,” Reds manager David Bell said. “We’re not comparing ourselves to anyone else. We like where we are. We’re continuing to work to get better. We believe we have a foundation to have a really strong starting staff.”

The Reds might have one of the most unsung rotations, especially since electric-stuff left-hander Nick Lodolo returned from a long-term leg injury April 13, giving them competitive big-league starters six deep – which, in turn, helps cover the injured-list loss the next two weeks of Opening Day starter Frankie Montas (bruised forearm).

None of them have been All-Stars. Hunter Greene is the only one assured of being under contract with the Reds after October.

But they were the focus of the front office over the winter, with Montas and Martinez added on short-term contracts. And they are the reason the Reds will win the National League Central for the first time in 12 years if they’re able to pull it off.

And they might just start looking even more like this veteran Phillies group by then if that happens.

“That’s the expectation for all of us,” Greene said. “I know we have the talent. I don’t think anybody doubts that within our own organization and our team. Obviously, those guys with Philly and some of the other (better) rotations have a little more experience. We can’t rush that process; it comes with time.

“All we can do is continue to learn as quick as possible and try to close that gap when competing against rotations like these.”

They’re going to get plenty of chances at that over the next six weeks, with seven games against the Los Angeles Dodgers in that stretch, three against Baltimore’s No. 5 rotation in the game, seven against San Diego’s No. 7 starting staff and nine combined against the two teams in last fall’s World Series (Texas and Arizona).

“I’ll take our guys all the time,” Bell said.

As much as the next six weeks figure to be a big test for the Reds, it’ll take every bit of the four months after that to tell this team’s story.

And it will almost certainly be the rotation that authors that story – as it is with almost every successful team in October. As it was last year when the Reds fell just short of the playoff field because of a battered and underperforming rotation.

If the Reds approximate anything close this season to what the Phillies have shown so far, it likely will be on the strength of a homegrown core of starters led by Lodolo and including Greene, Graham Ashcraft and relative newbie Andrew Abbott.

Short-term additions like Montas and Martinez can be big parts of that.

But to build a multi-year winner like the 2022 NL-champion Phillies have, can this pitching staff do it without adding that Zack Wheeler along the way?

“I guess you can, but really when you look throughout baseball history – not talking about before free agency – there are very few really great pitching staffs that are all homegrown,” said Phillies president Dave Dombrowski, the architect of the Phillies playoff roster – and World Series rosters in Boston, Detroit, and Miami before that.

“Look at Baltimore. They’re a homegrown club. But they just went out and traded for Corbin Burnes (from Milwaukee),” he said. “Sometimes if you’re going to get overt the hump to do it, you have to make those decisions yourself. … It’s a challenge to do it no matter what.”

The Reds obviously aren’t trying to go all-homegrown. With an opportunity to win at hand, they doubled down on pitching depth over an aggressive winter – including finishing second to the Cardinals for coveted free agent Sonny Gray, the former Red who got a three-year, $75 million deal from St. Louis.

“The answer is you can never have too much pitching,” said Dombrowski, whose club lost its $72 million starter Taijuan Walker to a shoulder impingement in March – which elevated February short-term free agent Spencer Turnbull into a bigger role (2-0, 1.23 in his first four starts).

“Just when you think you have enough, you won’t have enough,” said Dombrowski, who gets Walker back from the IL on Sunday. “ There’’s an injury factor all the time. We’re always trying to find pitching depth, either internally or externally.”

Some think he’s found enough this year to put the Phillies back on top in October for the first time since 2008 – and only the third time in franchise history.

Then, again, others think the Reds might have enough pitching depth to their own playoff run.

Dombrowski, in fact, is one who praised the quality of the Reds rotation unsolicited this week just ahead of the opener of their four-game series.

Maybe he knows better than most. The Reds won three of the first five meetings between the teams this season, with the Reds’ rotation producing a collective 3.18 ERA in those games.

Martinez said his staff compares well with the Phillies for quality of the pitches Reds arms can deliver.

“You look at just pure stuff, and Wheeler’s probably got the best pure stuff over there. Nick Lodolo probably has the best pure stuff on this side,” Martinez said. “I mean, I would like to watch that matchup one day.”

He missed seeing it by one day this series, but might yet get his chance if both teams get where they’re trying to go this year.

“You got some dawgs on both sides,” Martinez said. “The Phillies are just a little bit further down the timeline of their careers when it comes to experience.”

Which raises that other question: Can these guys become that staff without their Zack Wheeler?

“I don’t see why not,” Martinez said. “It’s hard to see into the future, but I believe in these guys. Just because they’re further ahead of us maybe in experience and where they are in their careers and knowing who they are, that doesn’t mean these guys can’t take half a season to figure it out, get in a groove, and now we’re, you know…”

You know.

“It’s the reason why we play this game,” Greene said. “We don’t want things easy. When we come out on top with teams like this, it gives us a lot more confidence moving forward …

“I want nothing more than to compete against the best of the best.”

This article originally appeared on Cincinnati Enquirer: Can Cincinnati Reds build contender rotation without a Zack Wheeler?